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Topic: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics  (Read 20917 times)

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(via email correspondence):

Smectite clay particles, since they are wafer thin, can help to actually heal tissue.  A clay particle will adhere to damaged tissue, protect it, and stimulate healing.  Healing tissue usually has a net positive charge.  Incidentally, scar tissue has a net negative charge.  Scar tissue actually slightly repels clay particles unless you use a thick gel (the electromagnetic field of the clay is stronger than surface charge of the scar tissue).

To contrast, illite can actually cause minor damage to healing tissue.  Thierry's mother would use Illite against a Buruli ulcer (infection), until the infection was gone.  When new granulating tissue would start to form, illite would actually start to cause bleeding.  They would then shift to using a montmorillonite clay to finish the healing.  One of the individuals I was corresponding with in Australia noted that the use of illite caused an increase in wound pain (buruli).  She would follow with a bentonite/montmorillonite poultice to sooth the area and eliminate the discomfort.

Zeolite is what I call a "water hating" colloid.  As such, the "water loving" swelling clays, like our green desert clay, or like other calcium/sodium bentonites, do a much better job at binding acidic waste (they are extremely alkaline) and making an actual change to the bio-terrain of the digestive tract.  They are REALLY good at removing heavy metals from bile, and preventing retention toxicity.  Illite is probably a bit better at breaking down biofilm.

Zeolite, being "roundish", will simply bounce off of substances that it cannot sorpt.  It will not likely adhere to anything, unlike smectite.  This has advantages and disadvantages.

Of course, as you know, zeolite itself is rock.  However, the micronized version of zeolite has an abundance particles small enough to enter the blood stream.

Traditional-use clays tend to work on detoxing the liver (but don't do much directly for kidneys)... due to the large particle size.

The smallest micronized zeolite particles seem to do a better job of detoxing the kidneys.  One clay user, who had been using clay for many, many years, found herself in stage 3 kidney failure.

We started including micronized zeolite, and she got a very severe healing reaction.  She adjusted to micronized zeolite use pretty easily, and after two years of regular use, completely restored kidney function.

All of these different particles have great-- and often unique-- uses. They are all a bit different even though they share the same general properties.

How does clay act as a catalyst?

The assumption is that it up-regulates genes responsible for Phase 1 detoxification.  That's the only method of action I can point to.

I assume this might happen when blood levels of a particular toxin decrease (as clay removes the stuff in bile), and as organ function improves.

This "strange" effect is so powerful that I've known toxic people that could only start with putting clay on the roof of the mouth (clay gel).  That is the only way they could tolerate "internal" use.

I'm assuming that the smallest zeolite particles in fully micronized zeolite do cross the blood brain barrier.  However, I was much more "enthused" about this when we had access to fully micronized zeolite, where we were looking at an abundance of particles sized 0.1 - 0.5, and 0.5 - 1.0 microns.

Bentonite and heavy metal cleansing:  Clinical research was done by a doctor in Japan using bentonite clay and cilantro.  It was demonstrated that the combination of the two safely removed heavy metals like mercury from the brain.  The clinical results were conclusive.

However, their time table might be wrong.  I believe the study was for about 3 weeks.  The researchers didn't have equipment like Dr. Chistopher Shade has to measure serum levels accurately.  So, I tend to do 3-4 weeks as a critical time frame for heavy metal detox, but think it can be 3-6 months before the body is really done purging them.

I still have a mouth full of mercury.  That was the first heavy metal cleanse I ever did. :)

Every so often, I do heavy metal challenge testing (DMSA), and my mercury (and other) levels are exceptionally low.  I also do tissue sensitivity testing (Elisa I believe) to make sure my immune system is non-metal reactive.  Sometimes this can be more important than the amount of heavy metals.  Some people are very tolerant, and some are extremely sensitive.

I hypothesize, based only on observations, that clay use calms the immune system.  I've seen this via oral use, and also clay baths.

I now use cilantro and garlic regularly for their ability to up-regulate detox and chelate mercury.  Dr. Shade also uses Haritaki; he claims that this plant has the most polyphenols which up-regulate detox.  I make tinctures, but only use them every so often, maybe a 1 ounce dropper bottle per year.

The bentonite/cilantro cleanse took care of my brain fog many years ago, and it did it quickly!  I was amazed!  I am assuming that the zeolite would do a good job too, it just might bind the metals more in the blood than the bile.  That's speculation only, based on the reports that people get good results using the zeolite, and the "Clay Disciples" have gotten great results using clay.

Some people can't tolerate cilantro, it causes too much of a metals dump into the blood stream... which is why I recommend people first do a digestive system cleanse (and hopefully get their eating habits on the right track), before trying anything that might put too much strain on the liver/kidneys.  At least two months.

I try to convince them to rehydrate the body during that phase, so if they do more cleansing, they are already used to drinking enough water.

We are close to some of the purest zeolite on the planet.  I looked into micronizing it myself, but it was just too expensive.  I thought I might be able to fully micronized zeolite and then sell it not labeled for human use (and thus outside of the jurisdiction of the FDA).

I always rely upon a holistic approach to heavy metal cleansing to ensure best possible results.  I also try to get people to use a sauna, or at least hot and cold showers!  I never rely upon one substance for anything.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2019, 08:38:07 PM by Jason »
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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2019, 07:38:49 PM »
Was the cilantro made into a tincture and taken with clay water?
Thanks!


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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2019, 08:56:45 PM »
...no.  If I remember correctly, raw chopped cilantro was used (about 1/4 cup per day).

Dr. Klinghardt, though, uses a tincture.  A tincture of both the leaves and the seeds would be ideal, if possible.

I myself simply throw chopped cilantro into a lunch soup.

If brain fog is caused by mercury toxicity, and if a person is not in retention toxicity (and thus cannot tolerate the cilantro at all), the brain fog goes really quickly, usually within three days or so.

Of course, I myself always use the "trifecta", garlic, cilantro and cayenne.  ;)

That said, individuals who are seriously toxic should apply much more caution for three to four weeks or so.
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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2019, 11:15:04 PM »
Are any of the clay nano sizes?


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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2019, 10:36:59 AM »
Hi -

The reason that clays are so fascinating is because of the complex characteristics which come with clay's crystalline properties.

In the "nano" world, clay particles are HUGE.  When you break them down, they become something other than clay.  All of the properties that make clay useful disappear, and you have something else in their place.

The smaller a particle becomes, the more dangerous it becomes, and you then have to really know the exact size, shape, and charge of the particle to understand how it is going to work in the body.

I'm not aware of anything out there that could be considered "clay" that has smaller particles than micronized zeolite, say around 0.1 microns in diameter.  That is 100 nanometers.  And even these tiny micronized zeolite particles lose some of the valuable properties that, say, micronized particles at 10 microns possess.

There may be something else out there that I'm not aware of.  It took me a long time to "get on board" with the use of crushed rock (micronized zeolite) as compared with traditional use therapeutic clays!

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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2019, 06:27:19 PM »
www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-do-you-stop-flesh-eating-bacteria-apply-clay/
I think 200 nanometers is smaller than 100, right?

This clay was unique in that they were very small particle size, 200 nanometers," or one four hundredth  of human hair, Williams says. Their suppliers—French companies Agriletz and Agricur—could not say where the clays came from,[/size][/size]


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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2019, 08:47:07 PM »
We can't even confirm exactly what these minerals were.  Without doing X-Ray diffraction, they could have been anything.  This particular work could NEVER be duplicated, because the original supplier did not have any more of the raw material, and refused to even say where they mined it from.

Not the best science, in my book, as least as far as identifying and studying the source materail.

200 nanometers is larger than 100 nanometers.

The clay that was ACTUALLY used in Africa for Buruli was sized at about 20 microns in diameter.

You should read this article very carefully, as it challenges the central idea of "killer clays":

http://www.eytonsearth.org/buruli-ulcer.php

We also have a complete copy of the entire ASU study done in the science section at Eytons' Earth.

Here is a typical definition of what a clay particle is:

"Grain size is classified as clay if the particle diameter is <0.002 mm, as silt if it is between 0.002 mm and 0.06 mm, or as sand if it is between 0.06 mm and 2 mm. Soil texture refers to the relative proportions of sand, silt, and clay particle sizes, irrespective of chemical or mineralogical composition."

The smallest is about 2000 nanometers, here... about 2 microns.

We might state that fully micronized zeolite can "defy" this definition, if the (mainly European) studies on fully micronized zeolite are correct as far as classifying particle size characteristics!

Clay minerology is quite complex.  I suppose we could change the definition of what makes clay, clay... but we've personally done testing on all of the popular clays used in natural medicine.

Clay is special because it selectively interacts with the environment.  This is likely due to its crystalline nature.  Once you break the particle down to the point where it does not have crystalline properties, that's when I believe it is no longer clay.

You should know that very few companies selling or mining clay get it right (accurate classification).  Sometimes, they even sell clay as one type, and it turns out to be another type altogether.

Terramin also makes the claim of super secret small minerals, but we had it tested (we love the clay by the way, we're just talking scientific accuracy here) by one of the nations experts on clay mineralogy, and we were able to classify it properly.

Now, you might have particles made up of SiO2 (for example), and this is a very small particle, and you might accidently THINK that it is clay; and it may even be in the clay... it may have even been clay at one time, but now it's simply a weathered fragment of smectite (as an example).
« Last Edit: April 25, 2019, 11:47:29 AM by Jason »
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Jason R. Eaton
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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2019, 04:42:33 PM »
...I sent an email to an associate to get his opinion on particle sizing as it pertains to clay.

He had a surprising yet interesting perspective:

"It is the thickness that generally relates best to the clay’s surface area, and therefore to its reactivity. The thinnest clay mineral crystal is probably smectite, which is composed of 0.9 nm-thick sheets, which are just one unit cell thick. When they form stacks of crystals, with swelling at their interfaces, the stacks of particles are of course much thicker. I don’t know much about a-b plane clay sizes."

I tend to look at particle sizing from the perspective of bio-availability/activity, but his perspective is certainly something to consider!
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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2022, 11:12:11 PM »
"Now, you might have particles made up of SiO2 (for example), and this is a very small particle, and you might accidently THINK that it is clay; and it may even be in the clay... " quote

Are you saying that the silice part of the clay could be of nano size?

PS not sure how to answer.... clicked on quote to get here and be able to comment....


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Maybe I can help you understand your question and answer about SiO2 and nano sizes. First, realize that generally speaking, what we refer to as 'nanoparticles' are anything smaller than 100nm. That is actually an enormous range, and countless particles qualify, such as the SiO2 molecules, along with every mineral ion that clay might include. But keep in mind that SiO2 on its own has nothing to do with clay. As Jason explains above, clay is very complex (and much larger!), and if you break it down too much, then you no longer have clay. The same is true for anything else of course.

Some further context - minerals such as magnesium, potassium, sodium, calcium, etc, are found in clay as ions, which are far below the 100nm limit. There can also be many other compounds (minerals or otherwise) that are larger than 100nm. Clay is a complex layered crystalline structure, and you can't really get it down into the nanometer range and still call it clay. Much of the magic of clay comes from it's complex structure and its relationship with water (i.e. hydrated clay).

By contrast, zeolite, while very similar to clay in it's atomic makeup, revolves around 'cages' in its crystalline  structure (i.e. rock, as Jason explains) without any layers. Zeolite is indestructible in the human body (well, at least the safe clinoptilolite variety), and it traps toxins within its 'cages' the same way that clay does within its layers (via cationic exchange). Zeolite can be made smaller because these 'self contained'  cages are so small. To my knowledge, there is only one company that has been able to reach the minimum size limit so far, which is about 2nm in size for a zeolite particle (you cannot go smaller than 2nm because that is theoretically the minimum size required for one cage). I use that zeolite and other clays and zeolites with my clients, because as Jason always points out, a variety of sizes can often be more helpful.



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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2022, 06:15:33 AM »
Thanks for explanation.
In a more simple way, does it mean that clay in itself is not nano sized and that if we deconstruct clay then we get to nano particules?
Meaning also that generally, overall, SiO2 and minerals are not nano, when found? Extracted? And are nano within clay?
Not sure I am very clear and hoping you get the sense of what I am saying.
Is 2nm smaller or bigger than 100nm?


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Re: Smectite, Illite, Zeolite - Conversation on Particle Characteristics
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2022, 01:53:49 PM »
Glad it helped a little  8) I know this stuff sounds very confusing. I'll try to make it simple.
Please watch my video here, as I think this might help you a lot:

"What are we made of?"
https://youtu.be/uQV0bD8QIxg

The industry makes it more confusing because of arbitrary 'cutoffs' to define certain market segments.
I'll answer your last question first: 2nm is smaller than 100nm. (nm = nanometer).

In most cases, when we use the term 'mineral' we are discussing something that is actually based on an atomic element... a single atom, and every atom is far smaller than 1nm.  Magnesium, potassium, calcium, etc. are all elements that we refer to as minerals, and we also often refer to them as electrolytes. There are more. Also note that oxygen, mercury, silver, hydrogen, lead, etc. are other atoms that

Some elements can float around in our bodies as a single atom... which we usually refer to as an ion, and many float around as a pair. Our body is very dynamic, so most things don't stay static for very long ;-)

The idea of 'nanoparticles' is mostly marketing hype. Its nonsense and should be ignored most of the time. Most things moving around in your body are nanoparticles... all the minerals, histamine, uric acid, etc., and we simply never talk about them as nanoparticles because it serves no marketing purpose. SO2 is a nanoparticle, but that is not relevant either. What is most relevant is if something is bioavailable or bioactive, and that happens at all different sizes. Proteins and other cells have an enormous range of sizes. And minerals.... well, they usually come 'trapped' in complex structures that may or may not be available to us. A mineral complex might be huge, and yet it might 'shed' it resources readily for our body to use, so size doesn't matter too much.

Context is everything, so let me give you some examples:

1. Most people have toxic ionic lead in their bodies. We never use the term nanoparticles when talking about lead toxicity; however, most lead toxicity is ionic lead that is less than 1nm in size. By contrast, clay contains lead, but that lead is not bioavailable because it is bound up in the clay, and thus cannot cause toxicity. The same is true for aluminum and other metals that are toxic to us in a toxic state.

2. Amalgam fillings have mercury in them, which is highly toxic. However, that mercury is bound up and does not often leech out into the body; however, if you have methane SIBO you are probably leeching quite a bit of mercury from this fillings! So again mercury itself is less than 1nm, but it must be released in a toxic form before it can harm us. Fish don't die from high mercury levels because they tend to have high selenium levels that bind the mercury. (I consume mustard seed and brazil nuts to get selenium, so that I have better protection from mercury poisoning).

3. Colloidal silver is a mix of silver ions and silver nanoparticles. Everyone markets their 'tiny' nanoparticles, which are hundreds or thousands of times larger than the silver ions! This is one of the most comic examples of how ridiculous the marketing is. Once again, size does not matter so much, because the 'huge' nanoparticles are clusters of hundreds or thousands of silver atoms, and the nanoparticles shed those atoms as silver ions under the right conditions. Decades of experience have showed us that homemade 'ionic' silver and all the various 'super special' silver nanoparticle solutions show no difference in efficacy... because they mostly end up as the same thing in the body. (However, I can make many arguments that the cheap homemade ionic solutions are far superior. Jason has much written about this too).

Not sure if I helped you understand or made it more confusing, but I tried ;-)
I do have more videos on this topic, and my videos show pictures of atomic structures, so that might help. Here are a couple of other videos that might aid you in understanding:

Fat vs Cancer
https://youtu.be/L5GS16b3tYM

The Power of MSM
https://youtu.be/r9yZwt90_lg
Enjoy!